Naruto Chapter 423 Discussion

[Sasuke Uchiha 4 Life]

Chapter 422 Is out, Predict away.

[KageFuma]

I was scared as hell when Kakashi got pierced by that tail/sword.

[-Erios-]

welll it seemed like a short chapter imo....damn those peins are scary! :p so they "pwnd" one of pein's body..niice i wonder which one is the healer one???and kakashi taking the clone justsu to a new whole level interesting.... yupp he is pure Hokage Material

[raugaj08_]

lol at the nin that said 'fuck you' to konan... hes gonna die a gruesome death...

sif say 'fuck you' to sexy konan :(

[Dream Catcher]

Holly crap that was awesome !!

Great chapter, short, but great. Tsunade is a weak Hokage Imo, not even fighting, the med peopel are there to heal, not the Hokage.

Pain's powers are pretty gruesome, but I never knew you could materialize thunder into a physical clone ! Pretty awesome.

I think the 4 face Pain will resurect or something and the battle will rage on

[-Erios-]

lol yeah that was silly of that shinobie to say that to konan...
i didnt know that the slug could also heal///thats new i dont know what is tsunade thinking ...trying to bring Naruto and now to go and heal the wounded....hummm worthy of a good hokage...

[NarutoforHokage]

I think were gonna see Pain get owned by Konaha in this next chapter. Its gonna be tough to fend off the smarts off Kakashi, Neji, Shika, and Shika's dad. Should be nice, Naruto gets to fight Nagato im guessing

[Hidden Ninja]

Holly crap that was awesome !!

Great chapter, short, but great. Tsunade is a weak Hokage Imo, not even fighting, the med peopel are there to heal, not the Hokage.

Pain's powers are pretty gruesome, but I never knew you could materialize thunder into a physical clone ! Pretty awesome.

I think the 4 face Pain will resurect or something and the battle will rage on

actually i think she is doing the right thing. there is currently no direct head villain to attack. its best for her to wait and she if the leader gets flushed out and then act. right now providing medical care to everyone is her job as a ninja. she is doing exactly how she was trained as a shinobi. medical ninjas are meant to stay alive.

i can not believe it, a whole chapter without naruto or sasuke. holy crap.

as to the lightning clone, i think its the same as an exploding clone. it has a second nature to its use.

[White Snake 66]

welll it seemed like a short chapter imo....damn those peins are scary! :p so they "pwnd" one of pein's body..niice i wonder which one is the healer one???and kakashi taking the clone justsu to a new whole level interesting.... yupp he is pure Hokage Material

i don`t think that that pain is dead(crushed by chioji and dad).he will probably revive and transform into something even stronger to keep kakashi and Co busy while G pain goes to look for the hokage.
he reminds me of sasori.:tsk:
WTF kakashi is so unpredictable a clone made out of lightning:biggrin1:
God Pain is probably going to flash them with something and go look for the hokage to ask her where naruto is at. the other pain will attack.

[Dream Catcher]

actually i think she is doing the right thing. there is currently no direct head villain to attack. its best for her to wait and she if the leader gets flushed out and then act. right now providing medical care to everyone is her job as a ninja. she is doing exactly how she was trained as a shinobi. medical ninjas are meant to stay alive.

i can not believe it, a whole chapter without naruto or sasuke. holy crap.

as to the lightning clone, i think its the same as an exploding clone. it has a second nature to its use.

Hmm I see what you're saying, I just don't think a med nin should be a Hokage. She should stay in the hospital and would be just as useful :p

Now about Pain losing to Konoha. No way. He took out Jirayia, there is no way he will lose. There's more to Pain than meets the eyes (plz don't sue me)

Kakashi is sure one helluva fighter. He's so sneaky and smart. I'm interested as to why he said "I can conserve chakra" or something like that. I have a feeling he is reading his moves and preparing for something big.

[-Erios-]

i don`t think that that pain is dead(crushed by chioji and dad).he will probably revive and transform into something even stronger to keep kakashi and Co busy while G pain goes to look for the hokage.
he reminds me of sasori.:tsk:
WTF kakashi is so unpredictable a clone made out of lightning:biggrin1:
God Pain is probably going to flash them with something and go look for the hokage to ask her where naruto is at. the other pain will attack.

well i dont see why he (pein) needs to have another level of "transformation" but yeah sounds possible since he has 4 heads ;)

[Dream Catcher]

Those heads are more probably aiding in his field of vision. Having 4 pairs of eyes sure as hell beats 2 ;)

[White Snake 66]

i just think that pain is not going to get killed that easily. they have proved me wrong time after time.

[Dream Catcher]

And why do you think he won't get killed so easily?

[-Erios-]

Those heads are more probably aiding in his field of vision. Having 4 pairs of eyes sure as hell beats 2 ;)

true but then pein is taking rinnegan to a new level adding 3 more pairs of eyes to the game... :confused:

[suiton]

awesome chapter:) this week both anime and manga are pretty good thx:) i saw that jman was really at the same level with naruto since kakashi realized the secret of pain in one second but jiraiya fought a long time and realized it before his death. kakashi is really a genius. and what he prepares for pain is possibly about mangekyou sharingan. and that hell pain isnt dead im sure an akatsuki member wont die that easily but chouji and his dad will take care of him and we will see that chouji is a really useful shinobi etc:) anyway good episode

[White Snake 66]

And why do you think he won't get killed so easily?

i mean when jman stabbed 3 pains right through their stomach i thought he actually killed them and boom they(pain)proved me wrong

[-Erios-]

awesome chapter:) this week both anime and manga are pretty good thx:) i saw that jman was really at the same level with naruto since kakashi realized the secret of pain in one second but jiraiya fought a long time and realized it before his death. kakashi is really a genius. and what he prepares for pain is possibly about mangekyou sharingan. and that hell pain isnt dead im sure an akatsuki member wont die that easily but chouji and his dad will take care of him and we will see that chouji is a really useful shinobi etc:) anyway good episode

but dont forget that kakashi has more Intel than jman did back then, thanks to jman and fukusaku kakshi is still alive :)

[suiton]

i meant the intelligence level of naruto and jman are at the same level:) this is too early here and couldnt wake up %100:) so sorry for mistakes

[White Snake 66]

Naruto did say it he is smarter than shikamaru
Kakashi does rock
Kakashi the 6th oooooooooooooooooooyeahhhhhhhhh:thumb:

[FerN]

The whole point of the Jman fight was for the others to know the secret of Pain, Kakashi never realized the secret of Pain in one second he had a flash back of what fukusaku told him, and that is all thanks to Jman

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

Naruto did say it he is smarter than shikamaru
Kakashi does rock
Kakashi the 6th oooooooooooooooooooyeahhhhhhhhh:thumb:

And you rely on what Naruto said, in my mind that's bullsh!t, just speculation, Shikamaru is probably the smartest in Konoha. Also, you get smarter with age, as you get to learn and continue your progression, when it was said that Kakashi was smarter than Shikamaru, Shika was still young, by now he should have easily surpassed Kakashi if he was ever weaker than him in terms of intelligence.

[White Snake 66]

Asuma did say that he was one of the best not the best.
i still think that kakashi is smarter than him :thumb:.

[suiton]

i agree that too but shikamaru has potential surely and he will get smarter in time

[White Snake 66]

i agree that too but shikamaru has potential surely and he will get smarter in time

yes ofcourse shika will surpass him it is ment to be lol:thumb:

[-Erios-]

no there is no way kakshi can outsmart shikamaru even kakashi has acknowledged the fact that shikamaru is sharper than him ( i think it was in the fight with kakusu)

[kkiiji]

Well apparently Shikamaru's dad is totally smarter than him, I wonder why they don't show him more often. He could probably figure out this whole deal if he's smarter than Shikamaru.

[oldskool uchiha]

One edge Kakashi has is the sharingan and it pick's up things in battle situation's quickly , that and he's pretty smart to boot .

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

Well apparently Shikamaru's dad is totally smarter than him, I wonder why they don't show him more often. He could probably figure out this whole deal if he's smarter than Shikamaru.

He's the one examining the Pein body they captured with Ibiki, so no he apparently can't figure it out just like that if he has to do that to discover Pein's secret....

One edge Kakashi has is the sharingan and it pick's up things in battle situation's quickly , that and he's pretty smart to boot .

So? Sharingan doesn't make you smarter, the fact is still that Shika is smarter. Sharingan is at better use when being employed by someone smart but it still has nothing to do with your thoughts and intelligence, in the end it's an eyesight technique....

[White Snake 66]

no there is no way kakshi can outsmart shikamaru even kakashi has acknowledged the fact that shikamaru is sharper than him ( i think it was in the fight with kakusu)

i wonder who would get a higher score on an IQ just kidding
Kakashi has proven many times of his smartness i just think shika is not there yet or maybe he is already
just an opinion:thumb:

[-Erios-]

Well apparently Shikamaru's dad is totally smarter than him, I wonder why they don't show him more often. He could probably figure out this whole deal if he's smarter than Shikamaru.

we dont know much about his father but i dont think he is smarter than him
i think that he only relies on experience ....but i could be wrong

[kkiiji]

Well remember when he kicked Shikamaru's ass on that Japanese chess game? The name of which eludes me at the moment.

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

Well remember when he kicked Shikamaru's ass on that Japanese chess game? The name of which eludes me at the moment.

But it's like I said, you get smarter with age. It would be totally normal for his father to be smarter considering he is much older, has seen more, lived more and experienced a lot more than Shika did, but the Naruto generation is bound to surpass all of the older ones, so Shika will most probably end up as the smartest in Konoha.

[-Erios-]

maybe so but i doubt he can think clearly of a good strategy while under pression (shika's dad) thats where shikamaru shines truly

[White Snake 66]

Well remember when he kicked Shikamaru's ass on that Japanese chess game? The name of which eludes me at the moment.

a game is a game
not to try to trow your idea off:thumb:

[kkiiji]

You know I think we might get to see a bit of Shika's dad soon. In times of crisis they always bust out all the older generation folks, it's kind of cheesy but at the same time totally awesome.

[suiton]

Well apparently Shikamaru's dad is totally smarter than him, .
is he? i dont think that comprasions are definitely true:)

[kkiiji]

a game is a game
not to try to trow your idea off:thumb:

Man chess is not just a game though, it's a total test of strategic superiority and wit. Somethings that a ninja must possess.

[NarutoforHokage]

He's the one examining the Pein body they captured with Ibiki, so no he apparently can't figure it out just like that if he has to do that to discover Pein's secret....


i think your thinkin of Ino's father. Shika's dad isnt examining the body, matter of fact we'll probably see him join the fight next chapter

[sasuke123uchiha]

You know I think we might get to see a bit of Shika's dad soon. In times of crisis they always bust out all the older generation folks, it's kind of cheesy but at the same time totally awesome.

i agree they started with chougi and his dad so i think all the other old gyz will show up

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

i think your thinkin of Ino's father. Shika's dad isnt examining the body, matter of fact we'll probably see him join the fight next chapter

Oh Shit, yeah, lol, my bad.

[oldskool uchiha]

He's the one examining the Pein body they captured with Ibiki, so no he apparently can't figure it out just like that if he has to do that to discover Pein's secret....



So? Sharingan doesn't make you smarter, the fact is still that Shika is smarter. Sharingan is at better use when being employed by someone smart but it still has nothing to do with your thoughts and intelligence, in the end it's an eyesight technique....

Didn't say that , it helps you analyze battle situation better , one of the reasons he is so capable a fighter . Calm down it is a discussion . If you are smarter than me overall but i can solve the puzzle faster does your intelligence help you that much more ? No .

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

Didn't say that , it helps you analyze battle situation better , one of the reasons he is so capable a fighter . Calm down it is a discussion . If you are smarter than me overall but i can solve the puzzle faster does your intelligence help you that much more ? No .

Oh but I'm very calm, since when does trying to prove a point means not being calm? Sigh...

And lol, I could bet anything Shika would solve a puzzle faster than Kakashi, Sasuke or Itachi, he's just that intelligent...

[mandelak]

like i thought pain is still pawning. but the lightning clone was freaking sick as.

to all the people that thought. he admitted himself that he can't defeat pain, lucky chouji and his father came.

i wonder if that asura pain dude is dead or if he will wake up again. im hoping he is dead. that would be cool.

i wonder if they will catch god pain. i don't think so. maybe with tsunade there as well they could. with her power she could immobilize him possibly. maybe we will see her sluginess. like jiraya and orochimaru had there different appearances as snake and frog man.

i wonder what tsunades is.

anyways was a sick chapter.

[suiton]

tsunade as slug would be cool and funny i never thougt something like this will happen:) but im sure tsunade isnt just a super powerfull medical ninja. she should have some secret in herself

[Raido]

awesome chapter:) this week both anime and manga are pretty good thx:) i saw that jman was really at the same level with naruto since kakashi realized the secret of pain in one second but jiraiya fought a long time and realized it before his death. kakashi is really a genius.

I don't get what you are saying about.. The old frog (Pa) told Kakashi all the informationi about Pain, which Jiraya gathered. Although, Kakashi sure is very clever tactician...

[Teh Goomba]

422 sucked the big one. I never say that a chapter sucked, and this one did. ROYALLY.

But moving along, of course Kakashi used a raiton clone, that's presumable. The stupid thing is demon pain suddenly got 6 arms somehow. This kind of silliness leads me to believe that Pain is not the "god" he claims to be, he is a pawn led by Madara, and I think now we really know who is at the center of the most feared organization in the Narutoverse.

[Hustlinaire]

I dont think this will happen anytime soon, but I think it will happen. But Sasuke wanted to attack Konoha out of anger/revenge/whatever, but I have a feeling when he gets there and see it has already been raided, he will get a nostalgic feeling about being in Konoha and also get touched by seeing his ex fellow villagers injured and reconstructing the village. He might still go after the elders but I dont think he will want to attack anyone else from the village. He might go after Danzou in particular.

But back on to topic about prediction, the next chapter I am predicting Kakashi to completely expose what he knows/figured out about Pein and the realms. And they might also show a glimpse of the chakra poles that Pein uses and maybe show that they understand it/beginning to understand it more(usually takes a few chapters). Naruto will be shown finishing his technique and no he will NOT make it back in time to fight anyone! I say this because this is what builds the story, he will come back to a village that is destroyed and with missing/dead comrades. It wouldnt make sense to have him come back now to fight Pein just to realize he needs to get stronger and go BACK into training to perfect another jutsu, etc... That is too repetitive and gets cliche. And also if they fought now, it would be like the story prematurely ejaculated and the rest of the story wouldnt make sense or would be pointless.

Oh I forgot! Kakashi is conserving his chakra to use MS and make the inactive Pein go. He will simply bypass the one who took the cloak off and go for the one who is just standing around.

[S.Haze]

Shikamaru is smarter than Kakashi since why would he figure out a plan against 2 s-class shinobi (kakuzu and hidan) and even Kakashi was surprised that he could figure that out so quickly.
It's quite obvious that Kakashi has conserved his chakra to use his MS (maybe a perfected one) and he will probably go for the one who has his cloak off.

[Rainz]

I don't think the Demon realm Pain is down and out just yet i think he could still be revived like the other Pain bodies in the Jiraiya fight. I also don't see them capturing God realm since he's the Pain thats most focused on if anything they may be able to capture another body. Besides all that I don't see anyone other than Naruto taking down Pain he is the holder of the rinnegan the most powerful eye technique and we're still barely scratching the surface of his abilities.

Other than that Kakashi was lucky he had Jmans info or he woulda been skewered. I think Kakashi has some new MS technique he's waiting to use at the right moment and will probably make Pain retreat after he's found out Naruto isn't there.

As for Tsunade you would think with the village under attack she would take personal command of the troops in the field instead of hanging back and using all her chakra to heal everyone (I'm guessing all or most of it since a large number of people are wounded) I dunno she just seems to be a very boring Hokage so far. With the 1st,3rd, and 4th we saw them meet the great challenges the village faced with awesome might with Tsunade we get slug healing. :(

[S.Haze]

Don't worry Tsunade has super strength and probably some sort of offensive type medical jutsu like kabuto but i have a feeling we haven't seen the best of her (perhaps she has a ultimate form like jirayas hermit mode).
IMO Kakashi taking down a Pain body is inevitable. He stored up his chakra (a handy technique for a guy with a small chakra pool) and he is probably going to release his MS and probably he has perfected it.

[Arty]

Ol'granny will fight soon ^^ She needs to die so yea - kinda important that she does fight for her life and village and looses.

Dno why everyone is so impressed about Kakashi whe he is clearly being owned -_- He tried to be offensive but it got countered so badly he had to get defensive. Looks as if Pain is just playing around there.

[Nordlicht]

I am just wondering what Kakashi realized. Only god realm's power or more about the general power of Pain? After seeing how Kakashi got sucked by the god realm it reminds me on Blackbeard in One Piece, so it could probably be something like gravity? Or was it just Ninjutsu and Kakashi figured out, that the god realm has more abilities (although he only saw that ability...).
I also don't think that the demon realm will stay dead, he will be revived and I think for this is no body necessary. As long as he receives chakra, so long as he will always be revived or so long his body don't get crushed or is out of the range of his "source", whatever it is, like the former summoner Pain.

I am curious what Kakashi has prepared for Pain, if he uses MS he will only have one try. But if the next chapter is called "Capture Pain", then he must have something to get him, but to be honest I can't imagine how. But then it must also be safe against summoning, because the summoner dude will just summon the captured Pain and meh.
And no Naruto and Sasuke this chapter, that's a little weird (although I don't miss the last one).

Ah yes, what the fuck was that scary thing with the hell realm? Was that Genjutsu?

[S.Haze]

Why does Kakashi only have one try with MS.
Against Deidara he used it twice and used it again to make that explosion disappear.
And if you are saying that because he got worn down while fighting Pain he did store his chakra.
Also he probably has trained MS so we don't know what its capable of now.

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

422 sucked the big one. I never say that a chapter sucked, and this one did. ROYALLY.

But moving along, of course Kakashi used a raiton clone, that's presumable. The stupid thing is demon pain suddenly got 6 arms somehow. This kind of silliness leads me to believe that Pain is not the "god" he claims to be, he is a pawn led by Madara, and I think now we really know who is at the center of the most feared organization in the Narutoverse.

Sigh, some people kill me, each Pein is different, this one was a puppet, like Sasori, so yes he can have 6 arms.....

[CheerUp]

Against an enemy so powerful it seems logical that Tsunade makes sure that first everyone is safe.

And then she will use her strength for retaliation.
This is what also happened when Oro came to town...

And I do agree that she will go down ...

[Drunken_Master_Rock_Lee]

I'll be pretty pissed at Kishi if Tsunade dies, 2 times the village gets attacked, 2 times the Hokage dies, come on, lack of originality if it happens....

[joyeux]

Decent chapter. Nothing exceptional displayed or any important revelations unearthed but a good read though. Probably be a great anime episode. At this pace, this Pain invasion arc is gonna take another 12-16 chapters to complete. Since the story has been catered to the idea that our hero (Naruto) will avenge his teacher, we can infer that Pain won't be defeated during this battle. As much as I like seeing the old teams working together and defending their village, it seems a drawn out way of showcasing Pain's abilities before his epic confrontation with Naruto.

[-Erios-]

I'll be pretty pissed at Kishi if Tsunade dies, 2 times the village gets attacked, 2 times the Hokage dies, come on, lack of originality if it happens....

agree with you he needs to come up with something new

[papfles]

agree with you he needs to come up with something new

Well, if the current translation is accurate then Tsunade might die because she exhausted her chakra. (since she apparently told her sumon to use her chakra to heal the wounded). So technically, if there are enough wounded, she might die, trying to heal those.

(and if it is true, then nice way to allow someone else to use your chakra ^^)

[-Erios-]

Well, if the current translation is accurate then Tsunade might die because she exhausted her chakra. (since she apparently told her sumon to use her chakra to heal the wounded). So technically, if there are enough wounded, she might die, trying to heal those.

(and if it is true, then nice way to allow someone else to use your chakra ^^)

wait what new trans???
edit:NVM i get what you are saying

[WjRgX]

any guesses on that thing standing behind the hell realm guy and why we were shown part of it through the window before?

[papfles]

why we were shown part of it through the window before?

Only reason I can think of at that point is that they then move indoors to show another body of pain. Perhaps this body can overlook what's happening to the other pain, so that kishi can justify another escape from a lethal blow (somehow I think that's how he evaded Chouji)

[-Erios-]

hmm i dont know maybe its just a summon/reflection of that pein's spirit??

[0m3gA]

hmmm or it could be the real "pain"?

[-Erios-]

hmmm or it could be the real "pain"?

naa im 95% that isnt the real pein..why would he be there....

[Tro]

I think that the name pain is picked for a reasson.

Before Naruto will arrive in Konoha i predict some deaths to bring pain into Naruto's hart and of his friends.

We see chouji and his father going into battle right now.
I dont see 1 of the nine rookies end in this part of the storie but i predict that this is gonne be the end of chouji's father.

I also think that in the next chapter that Tsunade will come face to face with Pain and we will see why she bacame Hokage (might be her last battle)

[-Erios-]

well but which of the 6 peins will she fight?? most of them already engaged in battle with other shinobies

[nagato]

got alot to say. naruto cant come back cause he wont make it in time wont be prepared to fight pein and still needs to train something more idk what though. why the hell doesnt anyone tell pein that naruto isnt in the damn village? and they have no idea where he is, doing so pein could possibly leave to find naruto somewhere else and leave hidden village alone. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/12/. omg peins using the force thats awesome. kakashi u scared me i thought u died thats not cool to do. thats embarissing for pein to have been killed by choji and his father cause hes god. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/17/ and lol peckaboo at the end for kakashi coming out of the rubble. if kakashi was there the whole time then that means he was studying what pein was with a shadow clone then getting information to fight him and use ms to fight him after his clone had died if the reinforcments didnt come.

[AS The Leader]

ghaa these chapter are so short!!We need more!
If the real Pein is out there, I guess it would be the one who started the fight with Kakashi, the other just have special abilities but he has in my opinion the power to control them, maybe more a defensive guy but hey, he's beatable he got caught by Kakashi's trick and one of them didn't see Choji's father's attack.
Amazing though how fast Kakashi could understand Pein's technique!Of course he had more information on Pein than Jiraiya did but still

[Atrocious Angel]

(srry 4 double posting see my post below)

[Murdock]

no nnooooooooooooooo no Obito theory again ... well IMO chapter seemed so short because it was only about Konoha invasion and no side stories .. looking forward to next week it could very the same as this week i mean only Konoha no Naruto no Sasuke ... maybe something about Raikage and co if we get lucky ...

[Atrocious Angel]

i think 1 of the peins has to beat a shinobi team (i dont know which 1)i almost know that tobi is obito and wants his eye back and also think kakasi will die in his fight wiht god pain and because he is god pain who is to know for sure that he cant creat more forms or reserect another body and i think i figured out what pains eyes do they control a persons mind how else can he move kakasis body??? and who knows maybe the other peins have some sort of strange quality (4 faces is just 1)

[br4nd0nh347]

eh Tsunade can't die it's too soon. (I don't like her as a Hokage much, but if she lasted a little longer I might change my opinion)

[-Erios-]

no nnooooooooooooooo no Obito theory again ... well IMO chapter seemed so short because it was only about Konoha invasion and no side stories .. looking forward to next week it could very the same as this week i mean only Konoha no Naruto no Sasuke ... maybe something about Raikage and co if we get lucky ...

naa i dont think we'll see the raikage anytime soon

[Murdock]

i wrote raikage and co - meaning the team he sent to find Killer Bee ... it was bad said sry

[-Erios-]

well but if we see that team we would probably end up having another sasuke arc -_- and well konoha is being destroyed so kishi will probably focus more on konoha

[UndrDog]

Heh, well we have heard from two of the best tacticians that Chouji is one of the strongest, if not the strongest from his generation. I know it sounds odd but it's completely possible. I can easily see Chouji taking Pein on one-on-one for awhile. Just long enough for Kakashi to make an admiring remark. I can also see Chouji showing his father up during this fight.

*Note: Kakashi complimented Shikamaru on his observational skills; and Kiba on his chakra control. In some translations in both cases he was said to say that they surpassed his own. I'm pretty sure we'll continue seeing instances of those from Naruto's generation glaringly surpass their elders.


Anyway I see this as being another time for the young to surpass the old. I'm not sure who's going to bite the big one this time around but I'm sure somebody will.

My prediction, Chouji and his father take care of the puppet Pein while Kakashi goes at the other. At around the same time, both Chouji/His father and Kakashi win their fights. Kakashi is badly beaten up and it becomes obvious that, though they had won their respected battles, Pein is still very much alive. Kakashi sends the other two away to report Pein's weakness to the Hokage while he finishes off his Pein. After they leave, Kakashi, weakened, is ambushed and slain by Konan.

Kakashi goes out with a bang.
It would be a surprise since he had won that fight.
Pein survives.
Konoha learns Pein's secret.
Kakashi doesn't die in vain.
More motivation for not only Naruto, but for Sakura as well.
Naruto's generation is being forced to grow up and take on the adult roles that are being opened up by their elder's deaths.

Then again that kills any chance of Kakashi learning the meaning behind Tobi's Sharingan... -_+ Not to mention some sort of dialog with Sasuke which we almost know is coming.

[naruto_fan_390]

i just want to say i tolded all you this would happen like two weeks ago. kakashi is going to show some more badass jutsu next week. kill 1 more pain but not "god" pain. then pain will pull out because marada will call him back and naruto isnt there.

[papfles]

HMmm, very possible undrdog (long time no see), but I don't think that kishi is going to pull a double "let's kill someone so that we can reveal another piece of the pain-puzzle". He's going to do it in another fashion IF he decides to take someone out.

[naruto_fan_390]

Heh, well we have heard from two of the best tacticians that Chouji is one of the strongest, if not the strongest from his generation. I know it sounds odd but it's completely possible. I can easily see Chouji taking Pein on one-on-one for awhile. Just long enough for Kakashi to make an admiring remark. I can also see Chouji showing his father up during this fight.

*Note: Kakashi complimented Shikamaru on his observational skills; and Kiba on his chakra control. In some translations in both cases he was said to say that they surpassed his own. I'm pretty sure we'll continue seeing instances of those from Naruto's generation glaringly surpass their elders.


Anyway I see this as being another time for the young to surpass the old. I'm not sure who's going to bite the big one this time around but I'm sure somebody will.

My prediction, Chouji and his father take care of the puppet Pein while Kakashi goes at the other. At around the same time, both Chouji/His father and Kakashi win their fights. Kakashi is badly beaten up and it becomes obvious that, though they had won their respected battles, Pein is still very much alive. Kakashi sends the other two away to report Pein's weakness to the Hokage while he finishes off his Pein. After they leave, Kakashi, weakened, is ambushed and slain by Konan.

Kakashi goes out with a bang.
It would be a surprise since he had won that fight.
Pein survives.
Konoha learns Pein's secret.
Kakashi doesn't die in vain.
More motivation for not only Naruto, but for Sakura as well.
Naruto's generation is being forced to grow up and take on the adult roles that are being opened up by their elder's deaths.

Then again that kills any chance of Kakashi learning the meaning behind Tobi's Sharingan... -_+ Not to mention some sort of dialog with Sasuke which we almost know is coming.

to put it plan. NO kakashi isnt going to die, not yet at least. he has to become hokage.

[UndrDog]

then pain will pull out because marada will call him back and naruto isnt there.

Sounds very sound since that scenario is backed up by the history of this series.

HMmm, very possible undrdog (long time no see), but I don't think that kishi is going to pull a double "let's kill someone so that we can reveal another piece of the pain-puzzle". He's going to do it in another fashion IF he decides to take someone out.

Yeah, you're probably right. Plus Kakashi has SO many ties to people he hasn't gotten a chance to converse with. I'll retract my prediction on grounds that it is stupid.

However I'm going to continue cheering for Chouji to completely show everyone up. Plus I want to hear Tobi (not Madara, but Tobi) tell the rest of the Akatsuki that "Pein got his rear handed to him by some fat kid". ^_^

[-Erios-]

Sounds very sound since that scenario is backed up by the history of this series.



Yeah, you're probably right. Plus Kakashi has SO many ties to people he hasn't gotten a chance to converse with. I'll retract my prediction on grounds that it is stupid.

However I'm going to continue cheering for Chouji to completely show everyone up. Plus I want to hear Tobi (not Madara, but Tobi) tell the rest of the Akatsuki that "Pein got his rear handed to him by some fat kid". ^_^

why chouji?

@undrdog i doubt kakshi will die?? i mean was that what kishi meant by i will focus more on kakashi and sakura?? by killing them??

[naruto_fan_390]

Sounds very sound since that scenario is backed up by the history of this series.



Yeah, you're probably right. Plus Kakashi has SO many ties to people he hasn't gotten a chance to converse with. I'll retract my prediction on grounds that it is stupid.

However I'm going to continue cheering for Chouji to completely show everyone up. Plus I want to hear Tobi (not Madara, but Tobi) tell the rest of the Akatsuki that "Pein got his rear handed to him by some fat kid". ^_^

yeah that would be fun as hell. i can see now.
Tobi: guys pain just got killed by some fat kid named Chouji.
Akatsuki: who the fuck is Chouji?

[UndrDog]

why chouji?

@undrdog i doubt kakshi will die?? i mean was that what kishi meant by i will focus more on kakashi and sakura?? by killing them??

I don't quite understand what you mean. Could you rephrase it for me?

As for Chouji, on separate occasions, Asuma and Shikamaru mentioned that he was an incredibly strong ninja, possibly the strongest of his generation. Now to be fair, one is best friends with Chouji and the other was on his death bed. But still, both of them have been proven to be two of the most intelligent shinobi in Konoha. Either way I'd like to see him back up their confidence in him.

And besides, he's actually there. lol It's getting rare to have one of the Konoha 11 get some spotlight away from his/her peers.

[-Erios-]

I don't quite understand what you mean. Could you rephrase it for me?

As for Chouji, on separate occasions, Asuma and Shikamaru mentioned that he was an incredibly strong ninja, possibly the strongest of his generation. Now to be fair, one is best friends with Chouji and the other was on his death bed. But still, both of them have been proven to be two of the most intelligent shinobi in Konoha. Either way I'd like to see him back up their confidence in him.

And besides, he's actually there. lol It's getting rare to have one of the Konoha 11 get some spotlight away from his/her peers.

I said why chouji since imo he is as useful as Ten-ten
and like you said maybe shika ans azuma said that to him since they are close to him...

[UndrDog]

Yeah... But I can still cheer for the underdogs... lol

And come on, Tenten's like the only on that's ACTUALLY A NINJA! lol She's the definition of "hide in the shadows and lodge a knife between your vertebrae." =P

[papfles]

I said why chouji since imo he is as useful as Ten-ten
and like you said maybe shika ans azuma said that to him since they are close to him...

As useful as tenten? That's quite the insult to chouji. The only thing that tenten has ever done is be a training purpose for neji's kaiten and to serve as a hilarious phrase for the English lesson in the gaki no tsukai-series.

[Seraphiel]

As useful as tenten? That's quite the insult to chouji. The only thing that tenten has ever done is be a training purpose for neji's kaiten and to serve as a hilarious phrase for the English lesson in the gaki no tsukai-series.

rofl yeah,I hope we see more kakashi next chap,oh and I want to see either zetsu,madara or kisame standing over the beaten niger.

And more of Sasuke.

Konan should fight more,and what was that old looking pein doing?

+yahiko pein was WTF HAX when kakashi used rai bunshin.

[papfles]

The question about the rai bunshin = does it split chakra like a KB

If so: why the hell did kakashi say he preserved chakra, because he just lost half in that rai bunshin... meaning he's pretty low, since he doesn't have a large chakra pool anyway (and is loading another raikiri as he said those words)

[Itachi_the_Feared_One]

what bothers me , is that kakashi did not mention rinn'egan.... not a single word about it, overall I am glad to see Kakashi performing well in this fight, noticed he could extend his raikiri like sasuke...I bet ... the demon realm crushed by chouji's dad will be revived somehow...and either human or animal realm will turn up and join pain in the fight.

[mtv637]

haven't naruto been training long enough. gosh 3 years and for most of the time jump too. however back to the topic i believe kakashi will reveal the truth about who or what the heck pain is and then akatsuki will retreat and naruto comes back too late and ends up fighting... sasuke?

[KageNaruto]

The question about the rai bunshin = does it split chakra like a KB

If so: why the hell did kakashi say he preserved chakra, because he just lost half in that rai bunshin... meaning he's pretty low, since he doesn't have a large chakra pool anyway (and is loading another raikiri as he said those words)

Considering all the clone look good for is getting your opponent a surprise electric shock, I doubt it uses a lot of chakra. I doubt it can even fight, probably zaps on contact.

[nagato]

Considering all the clone look good for is getting your opponent a surprise electric shock, I doubt it uses a lot of chakra. I doubt it can even fight, probably zaps on contact.

the whole time after kakashi was blown away from pein that was a riakiggigiga kakashi not the real 1 he was hiding

[KageNaruto]

Actually we have no idea when he made the clone,if he substituted with it, what happened, it shall remain unknown. That is the mystery of a ninja.

[nagato]

Actually we have no idea when he made the clone,if he substituted with it, what happened, it shall remain unknown. That is the mystery of a ninja.

does anyone other then me think its funny how kakashi just pops up on the bottom left corner. hes like peekaboo http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/17/

[KageNaruto]

As useful as tenten? That's quite the insult to chouji. The only thing that tenten has ever done is be a training purpose for neji's kaiten and to serve as a hilarious phrase for the English lesson in the gaki no tsukai-series.

-_-

Watch the beggining of this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bD8u8Rh5SYI

Maybe if she had more panel time... we would actually see her own.

[Providence086]

I think Pain is the Tsuchikage if you look a the symbol on page 04.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/04/

He must have invaded the Rain Village it is closest to the Rock Village. The symbol looks very similar to the Kage in this link on the bottom of the page middle right.

http://www.narutocentral.com/country-guide/

[mithis]

Based on this page, he recalls being told that each one has it's own power. The trick is figuring it out. I think the only power he figured out is that this one is a puppet master or even a puppet.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/10/

Beyond that, I don't see anything telling.

[KageNaruto]

Technically all the bodies are puppets. So I don't think that applies, this one was like a human weapon of sorts from the looks of it. There's really no specific trick to fighting that other than kill it... but w/e.

[lilcresloks]

i think that kakashi made that from watching itachi shadow clone explosion

[gamamichi]

story arc rocks..i think masashi will finish naruto in 2010..hurray 4 kakashi!! and i got a prediction,i think konan is the real pain.wahahaha

[jiraiya san]

pains not going to died just yeah,because the real one isn't there remember

[KageNaruto]

i think that kakashi made that from watching itachi shadow clone explosion

What the hell do the 2 even have in common?

We already should know there's a clone for EVERY medium. And since Kakashi is a lightning guy it was only expected.

[jiraiya san]

may be the thing on the upper left of page 4 is the eye of the real pain and that's the reason why the clones can predict the attacks may be is just a thought

[-Erios-]

may be the thing on the upper left of page 4 is the eye of the real pain and that's the reason why the clones can predict the attacks may be is just a thought

that thing on page 4 is the same thing thats on the back of the body of pein....

[sasuke123uchiha]

What the hell do the 2 even have in common?

We already should know there's a clone for EVERY medium. And since Kakashi is a lightning guy it was only expected.

siois naruto's kagebunshin wind element?

[jiraiya san]

on the back of pains body? and if not the eye may be it could be another monster because the one that sakura kill had the same thing on it face

[KageNaruto]

siois naruto's kagebunshin wind element?

Since he's been practicing sage mode and "that jutsu" after he learned to use the element, I don't see when he would learn this, nor who would tell him how since there seems to be no wind users in Konoha he is affiliated with.

[joyeux]

Based on this page, he recalls being told that each one has it's own power. The trick is figuring it out. I think the only power he figured out is that this one is a puppet master or even a puppet.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/10/

Beyond that, I don't see anything telling.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/12/

Apparently, he's figured out something about how god realm pain's power works. We saw him disrupt/repel his earlier attack and now he mysteriously is able to draw in his shadow clone. I think he has seen something with his sharigan that's giving him this insight.

[Erotique]

I predict that Tsunade will make her appearance...

And die...

No, seriously...

[-Erios-]

naa for as much i agree i dont think its gonna be an easy kill for pein he is gonna have a though time fighting her...

[lilcresloks]

What the hell do the 2 even have in common?

We already should know there's a clone for EVERY medium. And since Kakashi is a lightning guy it was only expected.

the sharigan, and that wasnt an ordinary lightning clone...... why clones dont do nothin to u when they r killed

[KageNaruto]

the sharigan, and that wasnt an ordinary lightning clone...... why clones dont do nothin to u when they r killed

-_-

I meant what does an exploding bunshin have in common with a lightning bunshin other than the bunshin part. Might as well say he got it from a wood clone or a shadow clone.

Because we haven't yet seen a medium that does damage in clone form? Ink, wood, water, and "shadows" don't hurt things. Electricity does. I would assume a fire clone would do the same thing, burn on disruption in a similar way.

[lilcresloks]

-_-

I meant what does an exploding bunshin have in common with a lightning bunshin other than the bunshin part. Might as well say he got it from a wood clone or a shadow clone.

Because we haven't yet seen a medium that does damage in clone form? Ink, wood, water, and "shadows" don't hurt things. Electricity does. I would assume a fire clone would do the same thing, burn on disruption in a similar way.

alright but itachi is fire right he dont use fire bunshin he uses shadow bunshin and makes it explode just like sasuke is fire and he dont use fire bunshin either

[KageNaruto]

And Kakashi hasn't used a raiton bunshin until now, and also used kage bunshin.

Major fallacy.

[lilcresloks]

And Kakashi hasn't used a raiton bunshin until now, and also used kage bunshin.

Major fallacy.

yea after he already fought itachi, why havnt we seen a member of kanoha use a fire clone if most of them use fire

[KageNaruto]

Fought Itachi pre-timeskip-_-. And hasn't used it till now. How do you copy an exploding bunshin and get lightning as a result?

Stop with the fallacies please.

[lilcresloks]

Fought Itachi pre-timeskip-_-. And hasn't used it till now. How do you copy an exploding bunshin and get lightning as a result?

Stop with the fallacies please.

cuz a clone is a clone and they could make em all explode

[KageNaruto]

You know what, that made no sense at all. I am out of here.

[mandelak]

firstly if he copied itachis clone he would have an exploding bunshin not a lightning bunshin.

i think he may have just produced a raiton bunshin after seeing everyone else using it. he just created more jutsu to use with his element besides having only raikiri now he has more than 1 original jutsu.

all it is, is a bunshin with its element. like kage said there have been water, wood, clay, and what ever itachi's was most likely fire clone. the reason others may not use it is because they either don't want to or haven't thought of doing something like that.



i also think wind bunshin would do damage too

[lilcresloks]

You know what, that made no sense at all. I am out of here.

its like this
water dragon jutsu
dragon flame jutsu

different styles but same thing so why cant he make a lighting clone that explodes

[-Erios-]

c'mon we have to give kakashi some credit for the jutsus has,
he does not necessarily has to copy it to have it ( i know he isknown to be the copy ninja) but he could just make it himself ... i mean with his knowledge it shouldnt be too hard for him to make it..

[mandelak]

exactly, like that lightning dog. he hasnt seen kirin, but he has done that.

he is the creator of chidori so why can't he have raikiri variations too.

reason i think that bunshin was a raikiri is because when he came out from under the rubble he had a raikiri in his hand. so its possible that he used raikiri to create the bunshin from a distance.

[KageNaruto]

its like this
water dragon jutsu
dragon flame jutsu

different styles but same thing so why cant he make a lighting clone that explodes

Those two are totally different things due to the fact that they are different elements! It's like saying I can use a sickle, and because of that I should be able to use a katana too! No!

And it didn't explode, it turned into a mass of electricity.

OK, last post from me on this for sure, it is NOT worth a debate.

Itachi had NOTHING to do with Kakashi's clone.

[lilcresloks]

naw im not saying he copy it im say he came up with it from seen itachi, like naruto copy sasuke

[KageNaruto]

No, no, no.

Blah-_-.

*shoots self in head*

[raugaj08_]

naw im not saying he copy it im say he came up with it from seen itachi, like naruto copy sasuke

nar dont think kakashi got the idea of lightning clone from itachi's exploding clone...

itachi's exploding clone = kage buushin + explosive tag

kakashi's lightning clone = lightning element in the form of kakashi

and naruto copy sasuke? in what?

[KageNaruto]

itachi's exploding clone = kage buushin + explosive tag



No, it explodes by itself, probably from the way its chakra is built up within it. We don't know if they are able to fight freelylike kage bunshin yet.

[lilcresloks]

Those two are totally different things due to the fact that they are different elements! It's like saying I can use a sickle, and because of that I should be able to use a katana too! No!

And it didn't explode, it turned into a mass of electricity.

OK, last post from me on this for sure, it is NOT worth a debate.

Itachi had NOTHING to do with Kakashi's clone.

no its like when u train to use a katana u use a wooden one first to practice
and then u use a real one

imma say it slow this time
water dragon jutsu= a dragon made out of water
dragon flame jutsu= a dragon made out of fire

different styles(water & fire) same thing dragon

[KageNaruto]

-_-.

Oh my God.

One explodes, and is made from normal chakra.

One is made from raiton chakra, and turns into a mass of electricity.

Walking into a high voltage fence, and walking over a landmine ARE NOT THE SAME THING.

****. Haven't displaced my anger like this for a while, lol.

[lilcresloks]

nar dont think kakashi got the idea of lightning clone from itachi's exploding clone...

itachi's exploding clone = kage buushin + explosive tag

kakashi's lightning clone = lightning element in the form of kakashi

and naruto copy sasuke? in what?

when he made uzamaki barrage from lions barrage

[Erotique]

No, no, no.

Blah-_-.

*shoots self in head*

Maybe Itachi copied Deidara? Thus, explodes himself and stuff?

*runs*

[KageNaruto]

Maybe Itachi copied Deidara? Thus, explodes himself and stuff?

*runs*

Yes, maybe Itachi saw Deidara and that's how he made exploding clones!

WHY CAN'T YOU SEE HOW YOUR ARGUMENT FAILS!??!

Not you Ero, even though I quoted you.

[raugaj08_]

No, it explodes by itself, probably from the way its chakra is built up within it. We don't know if they are able to fight freelylike kage bunshin yet.

well the way I saw it was that Itachi ordered hes 'able to fight' kage buushin to tag himself with an explosive seal...

the building up chakra thing is like all of Deidara's jutsus, then again Itachi couldve used hes sharingan to copy it as they've had an encounter b4...

[mandelak]

water dragon fire dragon.

same name different jutsu

kakashi created that jutsu just because. not because he saw itachi's jutsu, but because he thought it will be handy in a battle.

if he did copy the idea from anyone he copied it from kisame and dei. water clone, clay clone. or from yamato, wood clone.
they are more similar to kakashi's than explodning bunshin.

kakashis one does not do what itachi's does so they are different.

all the elemental clone is, is a different kind of shadow clone, meaning it just derived from the shadow clone.

shadow clone was probably the first and then someone said hey what about using my affinity with a bunshin.

ANYWAYS ignore the last parts

[Erotique]

Yes, maybe Itachi saw Deidara and that's how he made exploding clones!

It was a joke in my part, but I guess it did made some sort of sense...

Somehow...

[KageNaruto]

well the way I saw it was that Itachi ordered hes 'able to fight' kage buushin to tag himself with an explosive seal...

the building up chakra thing is like all of Deidara's jutsus, then again Itachi couldve used hes sharingan to copy it as they've had an encounter b4...

But we did not see the explosive tag, and the jutsu has its own name, Bunshin Bakuha. If it was just a tag, it would be called a tag, not an exploding clone.

And I was being sarcastic about the Deidara part.

[lilcresloks]

-_-.

Oh my God.

One explodes, and is made from normal chakra.

One is made from raiton chakra, and turns into a mass of electricity.

Walking into a high voltage fence, and walking over a landmine ARE NOT THE SAME THING.

****. Haven't displaced my anger like this for a while, lol.

ur not getting the important part different S T Y L E S as in
WATER,FIRE,EARTH DIFFERENT S T Y L E S

[KageNaruto]

ur not getting the important part different S T Y L E S as in
WATER,FIRE,EARTH DIFFERENT S T Y L E S

Oh my God dude. Just GTFO. Seriously. Everybody knows what you're trying to say, and everybody can tell it's a flawed statement (but you of course). Stop repeating your same flawed point OVER AND OVER.

[Erotique]

And I was being sarcastic about the Deidara part.

And I was being sarcastic on my last comment too...

Stop being so counter-sarcastic... damn you!!!! *howl*

[mandelak]

it may have the same name but its a different jutsu. different effect, different outcome.

if it was the same than it would do exactly the same thing and be called exactly the same thing and act in the exact same way.

its not the same.

and if anything kakashi's is the same as dei's caly bunshin or kisames water clone or yamatos wood clone. because those are elemental clones.

itachi was nothing like those. if anything kakashi created those after seeing clay, wood and water clones

[lilcresloks]

it may have the same name but its a different jutsu. different effect, different outcome.

if it was the same than it would do exactly the same thing and be called exactly the same thing and act in the exact same way.

its not the same.

and if anything kakashi's is the same as dei's caly bunshin or kisames water clone or yamatos wood clone. because those are elemental clones.

itachi was nothing like those. if anything kakashi created those after seeing clay, wood and water clones

yea but water clone dont do nothin to u when u kill them
but a water dragon can hurt u

[mandelak]

what has a water dragon got to do with a water clone or any clone for that matter.


the reason water clone doesnt hurt is because its water.

lightning would shazzzz out like that because its lightning and lightning isnt the type of element that is stable like that.

same as water clone or mud clone or wood clone they are the way they are because their element is like.

where as wind my exlode and cut the opponent fire would explode and electricity well will electrocute.

water will splash them or just splat on the floor. wood would just do what wood does. and clay melts same as mud

[lilcresloks]

what has a water dragon got to do with a water clone or any clone for that matter.


the reason water clone doesnt hurt is because its water.

lightning would shazzzz out like that because its lightning and lightning isnt the type of element that is stable like that.

same as water clone or mud clone or wood clone they are the way they are because their element is like.

where as wind my exlode and cut the opponent fire would explode and electricity well will electrocute.

water will splash them or just splat on the floor. wood would just do what wood does. and clay melts same as mud

then why dont any body use em like sasuke or itachi who have fire

[mandelak]

firstly we dont know if itachis is a fire clone. it could just be a build up of chakra and then explodes because of the pressure.

and what did sasuke do??????

[noerml]

I think Pain is the Tsuchikage if you look a the symbol on page 04.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/04/

He must have invaded the Rain Village it is closest to the Rock Village. The symbol looks very similar to the Kage in this link on the bottom of the page middle right.

http://www.narutocentral.com/country-guide/

i mean no offense, but that's about the most stupid theorie i ever heard.

the kanji on the rinnengan-illussion means "king", probably indicating that this is indeed the real pain.

[S.Haze]

I don't think Kakashi is going to die without knowing something about Tobi and his sharingan and just like Undrdog said a dialogue between Sasuke would be kinda nice.

When Raikage said that he would avenge his Bee when he was captured does this mean he is stronger than Bee? since Bee we know is very powerful and if Raikage thinks that he can avenge him doesn't that mean he is stronger than him? If so Raikage is probably verrrrrrrrry powerful.

[papfles]

@ lilcresloks: haha, sorry dude, but seriously, you've been outmatched here by quite the few miles ;)

@ s.haze: normally the kage of a village is the strongest in his village, so technically, the raikage should be stronger, but it may also be like Jiraiya (who refused the position, leaving it to tsunade). I guess we won't know until we see him, but we can assume his might is quite formidable.

[mandelak]

bee did say his brother is the only one that could face him equally and i think his brother is the one that cut off his horn while he was in bull mode

[Murdock]

Based on this page, he recalls being told that each one has it's own power. The trick is figuring it out. I think the only power he figured out is that this one is a puppet master or even a puppet.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/422/10/

Beyond that, I don't see anything telling.

IMO he figured out power of god pein and that being ability to pull or push objects( probably chakra since he repelled that raiton dog thing) ... at least that's what striked my mind about Kakashi figuring out


BUT if he can use only one power how come that GOD pain can use water jutsus? IMO when he is connected to all bodies he can use only one pwer per body but when he disconnect them - the part before J-Man fight we saw that he controled only 1 body (Yakiho - sp?) then he went into his "lab" so at that time he probably wasn't controling other bodies

never mind just thought :)

Fought Itachi pre-timeskip-_-. And hasn't used it till now. How do you copy an exploding bunshin and get lightning as a result?

Stop with the fallacies please.

well IMO he meant not copying exact jutsu but the idea of Bunshin harming soome1 when it is released ..

[noerml]

Why the fuck is everyone complaining about Tsunade not fighting. What the fuck do you people think is a Hokage's task? to dash into the battle head-first and showing off infront of your fellow countrymen? Ofc the general should be staying back. She's the hub, where all the information should run together, where battle orders are giving, where things are coordinated. A hokage is not about fighting...it's about running a village and protecting a country. Summoning her slug and healing everyone is quite a smart move that both helps her people and doesn't take her away from her job.

And whom is she going to fight anyways. When oro attacked it was kind of clear for Sarutobi...but now? should she split up in 6? pathetic....

However i do believe she will end up fighting pein at some point. But maybe it will not be her death yet...maybe she just used up so much of her chakra that she can't maintain her youthfull appearance any longer. COuld be a possibility. While technically i could see her dying, especially since all her mates, i.e. the sannin, oro and jman died already, that would leave the hokage spot vacant. Naruto is far from being a potential hokage candiate, while he is physically strong, his mind is kind of...slow... too slow ;-) his heart and his stomach do most of the thinking for him.
I don't see the point in appointing just another hokage...especially not Kakashi..he's way too cool for that *lol*. And it would make little to no sense story-wise. The only thing that would indeed make sense, if Danzou saw his opportunity, maybe actually being somehow involved in Tsunades death (maybe when she's utterly exhausted from healing everyone thru her slug), and became Hokage... that would somehow expell Naruto from Konoha as well... open up a new arc...and when he's rdy to defeat danzou he's rdy to take over hokage office *shrug*

[naruto reader]

its probably something kakashi made all the other jutsus he has exept raikiri we have seen somebody else use. this we havent seen anybodyus so its his own. Also i dont think he copied but he could have used the water clone as an example, or the eath clone, but this one its originaql and preaqty tough because it was fighting both pain at the same time.

[mandelak]

well he created the raikiri dog himself and that earth dog jutsu when the dogs came from the wall.

he hasnt seen those from anyone else. he never saw sasuke use any new jutsu so him creating those arent from seeing sasuke. its from his own knowledge

[naruto reader]

however it looks like the order for counter attack is given i think pain is in trouble now. And for those that think he can take on kahona by himself he cant. He took the rain village sure but there was a civil war there already, taking kahona by himself is an entirely different mater since its one of the 5 shinobi villages, if not the strongest

[naruto reader]

well he created the raikiri dog himself and that earth dog jutsu when the dogs came from the wall.

he hasnt seen those from anyone else. he never saw sasuke use any new jutsu so him creating those arent from seeing sasuke. its from his own knowledge

I agree that this is his jutsu and also i think now they will try to capture god relm, but i dont think they will succed that easily. He noticed the attack so he is probably stronger than the other realms. The hell realm didnt thats why its dead

[papfles]

It is considered the strongest, but pain is out of this world, so I don't think he would be so "in trouble" yet. Even if he would be defeated, as long as he can either keep his summoning body alive, or keep his original body alive, the fight isn't over.

The hell realm didnt thats why its dead

That's why it's down, no one can be sure it's dead. It had eyes in three directions, a bit weird that he didn't see the attack, and that the other one did. Besides, if the other one noticed the attack, so should the hell realm-body, because they're connected.

It's like kakuzu's fall. They thought it was "one down" too, but it wasn't at that time. This may be similar. Kishi building the advantage back to konoha before giving Pain a surprise card again without having to reveal too much, especially after showing hell realm's real body (which he hasn't exactly used yet).

[mandelak]

i doubt it got beat that easily. like pap said it had vision in 3 directions. pain god dodged it why didnt he


i think god realm controls the chakra of beings. not control like can make them do stuff but can do what he did to kakashi like he is a magnet or something for chakra and can make it negative and positive.

so with the raikiri dog he(pain-god) flipped it(something in himself) and it(kakashis raikiri dog) got repelled. for kakashi being dragged he reversed it and started to attract his chakra.

lol i know this makes no sense, but hopefully you can understand what im trying to say

[papfles]

for kakashi being dragged he reversed it and started to attract his chakra.

That's probably because he stabbed kakashi, and now has access to his "chakra", so that he can pull him in. I doubt he can do that to chouji at this point.

[Seraphiel]

That's probably because he stabbed kakashi, and now has access to his "chakra", so that he can pull him in. I doubt he can do that to chouji at this point.

I think his power is gravity,as fro asura he was prolly stunned from rai bunshin and couldn't move thats why he was crushed.

[mandelak]

That's probably because he stabbed kakashi, and now has access to his "chakra", so that he can pull him in. I doubt he can do that to chouji at this point.

i agree with that otherwise he could've done that at the beginning of the fight with kakashi

so it is starting to explain those piercings and what not more.

[Murdock]

I think his power is gravity,as fro asura he was prolly stunned from rai bunshin and couldn't move thats why he was crushed.

agree 100% ... and for chakra thing ... well yes it might be that he can control chakra the way you said mandelak - but Kishi giving such powers i mean it's too much jutsus are bigger and bigger i don't like it but that's just overall thing

but you're right he can somehow control probably chakra waves so he can pull it or push it away ... and that's probably what Kakashi has figured out

question is wheter he can do it without stabbing some1 with black stick or he gotta stab him first and by that "inject" something to be able to control him

[Seraphiel]

i agree with that otherwise he could've done that at the beginning of the fight with kakashi

so it is starting to explain those piercings and what not more.

Actually he prolly just needs to concentrate more on kakashi or something,cuz he didn't use it before kakashi was busy with asura,on another note it looks more like gravity control to me.

[mandelak]

agree 100% ... and for chakra thing ... well yes it might be that he can control chakra the way you said mandelak - but Kishi giving such powers i mean it's too much jutsus are bigger and bigger i don't like it but that's just overall thing

but you're right he can somehow control probably chakra waves so he can pull it or push it away ... and that's probably what Kakashi has figured out

question is wheter he can do it without stabbing some1 with black stick or he gotta stab him first and by that "inject" something to be able to control him

its possible that when he stabbed him with the pole thing that is what gives him the power to do that. so a bit of his chakra was inserted making kakashi respond to pain. with the rods in the body as piercings it is possible for full control, but with a stabbing it may enable him to do what he didf

[scrilla86]

umm hey guys long time no speak um about the gravity thing thats wrong it never happened to jirayai secondly stop worrying about what the bodys can and start worrying about what the eyes can do.

[papfles]

well, the combination of body + eyes is the problem, not the separate state of either body or eyes

[Murdock]

umm hey guys long time no speak um about the gravity thing thats wrong it never happened to jirayai secondly stop worrying about what the bodys can and start worrying about what the eyes can do.

well actually GOD Pain never fought J-Man directly so tehre was no cahnce of seeing that ... plus Kishi saved this for us to see it now ... actually we saw only chakra absorbing fat guy and summoning in action + guy launching his arm but not this much as in Kakashi's case so we actually can't ruled it out ...

[scrilla86]

oh ok now i see where your comming from you guys where just talking bout the god body i thought you meant pein in general so if thats the case let me ask you guys a question honestly do you think that if they kill pein he not gonna take some ppl with him at least the three fathers

[ChillO]

Funny discussion here about Kakashi the copy ninja.The manga states he has over 1000 jutsus copied. Be real, the genius about Kakashi and his nummerous justus is that he can magically poof all kind of never before seen justus out of his ass. He is in a different league all together and doesnt have to form or reform seen justsus his arsenal of jutsu is just that fast.

On god Pains powers I have a hunch this Pain can control the flow of chakra around him. So he can not only control someone elses chakra justus but the chakra from ninja as well(this depends on if Kakashi was using a clone all the time though). Gai and Lee to the rescue anyways :D. Oh well you can only hope to get more Kakashi Gai interactions ^_^

[Teh Goomba]

Gai and Lee will fight Fat juitsu absorbing Pain. This last chapter foretold it by the nins saying: "We'll just have to fight hand-to-hand".

[Sparda]

I don't think Pain will show his uberness in this fight much. His strength comes from the combination of his 6 bodies. Since they are not together, and scattered around Konoha, his effectiveness decreases. Once he learns the location of Naruto he will probably retreat with all his bodies and go after Naruto.

Also "none of them are real" thing probably means Pain is another entity controlling these 6 bodies from somewhere else. So the real strenght of Pain could be on another level compared to what we saw before.

I think the real fight between Pain vs Naruto won't happen now. Maybe Pain will learn Naruto's location, or Naruto will come to Konoha somehow, or they won't meet yet. The first fight between Naruto vs Pain will be against his 6 bodies but the real fight will be Naruto vs Real Pain which will be 1 vs 1 and show the real extend and power of Pain's bloodline limit. That's my prediction.

[R-Vinco]

Hello, Everyone

I've been reading this forum for about a year now and this chapter just forced me to create an account! It was fantastic, it got me really hyped about next week's issue. :o

Prediction- More kakashi badassary... and maybe what he realized before the chapter's end.

[blind]

Hello, Everyone

I've been reading this forum for about a year now and this chapter just forced me to create an account! It was fantastic, it got me really hyped about next week's issue. :o

Prediction- More kakashi badassary... and maybe what he realized before the chapter's end.

:welcome: to NC, and post everywhere. :D

I think he'll reveal what he's learned to shinobis that are fighting Pein, such as having to separate them in order to have a chance against them, so that'll probably be more vital to tell Chouji's father first. The other thing he's realized will probably be revealed to Naruto, when he does arrive.

[Itachi_the_Feared_One]

I think pain has more to offer than just using different bodies and their abilities, even if Konoha succeeds in neutralizing all bodies including the deva realm ( which by the way, looks more badass and powerful than the other)....still the real one is not there. and figuring out where or who is the real one will be left to tsunade...I believe kakashi will only be able to scratch the surface ( so to speak ) trying to understand pain....tsunade on the other hand will discover it (secret)....and if naruto could make it back to konoha then he might probably be the one to land the final blow on Pain.

[Atrocious Angel]

peins a smart person (if his is 1 lol) so i think if he is going against kakashi and is struggling he will call his other bodies back. maybe the trick to peins power is like the jutsu kisame and itachi used against guy, kakashi, naruto, sakura,granny,...etc but he altered the bodies in order to feel each others needs.remember just a thought but if it is true and remember itachi and kisame only used 30% of their over all chakura pein must really have a large mass of it or maybe pein is not really 1 person maybe just a group of people pooling their chakura

[Teh Goomba]

Perhaps the chakra Pain needs is gotten from those silly Akatsuki rings they all wear. We'll find it out soon.

[xxdyntaexx]

erm.. sorry correct me if am wrong.. there isnt really evidence to support this.. but is the reason, one pain dodged and the other pain got crushed because he was in contact with kakashi's clone.. i mean, when it was figured that it was a lightning clone, the first thing that popped to my head was sasuke's chidori blade, uno, how it stuns people. so to my mind, due to the fact that they share vision.. the did both see the big first coming down. but only one could dodge because the other was paralyzed(SP?)

[White Snake 66]

i think pein use the kyubies chakra to perform the rinnegan at the level he uses it .and people dont start jabbing about im wrong and he only wants the for world domination. but think about it Kyubies have large masses of chakra that can be transmitted to the real one and take the rinnegan to a whole other level :thumb:

[ACPRO]

i think pein use the kyubies chakra to perform the rinnegan at the level he uses it .and people dont start jabbing about im wrong and he only wants the for world domination. but think about it Kyubies have large masses of chakra that can be transmitted to the real one and take the rinnegan to a whole other level :thumb:

ummmmmm no. The only reason why pein was even assigned to get the kyuubi was because itachi was dead.

[White Snake 66]

ummmmmm no. The only reason why pein was even assigned to get the kyuubi was because itachi was dead.

I mean the real one controling The others he could use the chakra

[blind]

Perhaps the chakra Pain needs is gotten from those silly Akatsuki rings they all wear. We'll find it out soon.

If anything, wouldn't it make more sense for him to get chakra from his other body through his chakra receivers? I don't think the rings have anything to do with it.

[Erotique]

Perhaps, Pein's "rod" may work similar to that of Hidan's "curse" but with chakra. Chakra manipulation may work in order to execute the genjutsu; however, the way Kakashi was being "pulled" does seems like it has something to do with gravity or magnetism in some way.

[naruto_fan_390]

did anyone notice that kakashi, is using alot of jutsu. he is going burn up all his chakra soon if he keeps going at the pace he is now.

[White Snake 66]

Perhaps, Pein's "rod" may work similar to that of Hidan's "curse" but with chakra. Chakra manipulation may work in order to execute the genjutsu; however, the way Kakashi was being "pulled" does seems like it has something to do with gravity or magnetism in some way.

may be it puts some particle in the body which may give control to the body with genjutsu or some other way

[NarutoforHokage]

all kakashi has done so far is chidori, a lightning manipulaltion technique and a clone. I dont think that takes that much chakra to do a chidori, nor a clone. the manipulation technique took up a lil bit but kakashi stated that hes been saving his chakra so i dont think hes really worried right now

[DonEmu]

I think the rods just act as a means for him to remote control the bodies by channeling some of his chakra through them. Sorta like the jutsu he used to make those copies of Itachi and Kisame but this time he just controls the bodies of the subjects and doesn't morph them into copies of himself. So basically he is actually fighting using the chakra that those bodies naturally possess and just controlling em from afar, maybe using the Rin'negan. I have a feeling when all the rods are removed he can no longer use the body.

Also, i think that pulling thing was a form of telekinesis, maybe possibly being able to draw in or pull away chakra, so basically "chakra-kinesis" for lack of a better word.

[Atrocious Angel]

maybe the rods are there for that...but maybe they have other effects like being able to sence the others in danger or being able to subtract chakura from other bodies to add to 1 but isnt it impossible to have that impossible to have that much chakura like i said before maybe pain is not just 1 person maybe its a group of people???its possible u know...

[naruto_fan_390]

all kakashi has done so far is chidori, a lightning manipulaltion technique and a clone. I dont think that takes that much chakra to do a chidori, nor a clone. the manipulation technique took up a lil bit but kakashi stated that hes been saving his chakra so i dont think hes really worried right now

kakashi said he could only use chidori 3 times and he already used it 2 times then he used a lighting clone. I must be going crazy but i think kakashi has improve on his chakra levels. because your right he did say he had more chakra to burn.

[naruto_fan_390]

naruto isn't going to be back for a long time, if the writer is smart.
think about it naruto has to get the key still. Once he has the key he will be able fully control the 9T. we saw how powerful the 8T was with his beast in control, maybe the writer showed us that as a preview, he even owned sasake.

[mandelak]

maybe he created this variation because it doesnt take as much chakra as raikir.

isnt raikiri at the highest level of shape manipulation or something (if not please correct me)

so he created these so he wont waste as much chakra and also he can fight at a distance

[NarutoforHokage]

kakashi said he could only use chidori 3 times and he already used it 2 times then he used a lighting clone. I must be going crazy but i think kakashi has improve on his chakra levels. because your right he did say he had more chakra to burn.

actually he told Sasuke that Sasuke could only use chidori 3 times. He did say he had a limit but who knows how much it is, especially 3 years later after he said it

[NarutoSennin]

maybe he created this variation because it doesnt take as much chakra as raikir.

isnt raikiri at the highest level of shape manipulation or something (if not please correct me)

so he created these so he wont waste as much chakra and also he can fight at a distance


Isn't rasengan the highest level of shape manipulation?

[mandelak]

i thought its the highest form of chakra manipulation

[KageNaruto]

i thought its the highest form of chakra manipulation

Raikiri is-_-.

Rasengan is the shape manipulation.

FRS is highest shape with 50% of highest chakra.

[Murdock]

kakashi said he could only use chidori 3 times and he already used it 2 times then he used a lighting clone. I must be going crazy but i think kakashi has improve on his chakra levels. because your right he did say he had more chakra to burn.

actually he said he can use it 4 times ... but after time skip we saw he used Raikiri 6times so yes he's improved

actually he told Sasuke that Sasuke could only use chidori 3 times. He did say he had a limit but who knows how much it is, especially 3 years later after he said it

he told Sasuke that his limit is 2 shot and Kakashi's being 4 pre-time skip ... after time skip we saw that Kakashi used it 6 times already and we saw that Sasuke is using Raikiri here and there so he is imrpoved too

[Hakkar]

here is my prediction for the next chapters.
Pain will fight konoha for 2-3 chapter while Konan gathers intel. when she know that naruto is not in konoha, she will inform pain about that and they will leave (a little anti-climax :yawn: ) then naruto returns found konoha destroyed and ... it´s payback time. or for some reason Pa knows that the other frog is dead, naruto comes rushing to konoha and kick pain ass :biggrin1:

[papfles]

There is no reason for Pain to leave. He has even expressed going through everything and everyone to get to naruto, so if he's not there, too bad for konoha I fear.

[Naru-Ichi]

He will have to leave if his bodies keep getting killed. I doubt that he can actually take on all of Konoha by himself.

[sasuke123uchiha]

He will have to leave if his bodies keep getting killed. I doubt that he can actually take on all of Konoha by himself.

i doubt that he'll get out of there alive

[S.Haze]

The true body of Pain which is nagato (I think) controls all of the other bodies so my theory is that right now he is not there and teh true power of Rinnegan is some sort of puppet mastery without and strings and doesn't have to be in the battlefield.

[Owenotto]

i believe we have reached that conclusion in several earlier chapters...

[Sparda]

I really really think there is more to Rinnegan than controlling multiple bodies. We haven't even seen the 6th element that only Nagato can use. 6 bodies that each has different abilities. That is like fighting against 6 ninjas and ain't really that special. There has got to be more that makes this Rinnegan such a legendary ability.

[blind]

I really really think there is more to Rinnegan than controlling multiple bodies. We haven't even seen the 6th element that only Nagato can use. 6 bodies that each has different abilities. That is like fighting against 6 ninjas and ain't really that special. There has got to be more that makes this Rinnegan such a legendary ability.

6 shinobi with completely different skill sets, that can see through each others eyes, and who's skills rival that of a bloodline in terms of rarity. Other that allowing the user to learn a sixth element, I don't think there's much more to Rinnegan.

[suiton]

im expecting from rinegan much more too. but i guess we wont see that until naruto vs pain or nagato (whoever the real pain is) since the ultimate powers always showed at the final battles

[dharq]

I think this is shaping up to be a Tsunade vs Konan fight.. and talk about a really bad opponent for Tsunade... Paper beats rock, ya know.

[S.Haze]

i believe we have reached that conclusion in several earlier chapters...

Oh really?
anyways i'm also expecting a lot more to Rinnegan than knowing all elements and controlling 6 bodies because it's supposed to be the greatest doujutsu.
The sharingan proved to have 3 abilities and than you can also get an evolved form called mangekyou sharingan and then you can get the eternal mangekyou sharingan.

[Murdock]

yeah but Sharingan doesn't count since Kishi loves it waaaay to much that he gets wet at nights about dreaming about it

it was discussed many times that Sharingan's variations and abilities are added like 1 ability per month ...

so actually Rinnegan might be the most powerfull but Sharingan always win :) it's sad but it's true

[-Erios-]

yeah thats what I dont understand freaking kishi said that rinnegan is the strongest among the three eyes and well we've seen the Sharingan to be like the ultimate ......I dont know what he is gonna pull with the rin'negan to show us how much more power full it is/////

[dharq]

In some of the translations, the Rinnegan is stated to be the most rare or most legendary.. not the most powerful. I think it's rare enough that no one really knows enough about it to truly say it's the most powerful. Legend, myth, saying it's the most powerful doesn't necessarily make it so.

Rinnegan's the origin. Byakugan came later. Sharingan evolved from Byakugan, correct? (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/78/12/) If so, sharingan is probably the most powerful simply because of the mechanism involved with evolution.

Don't get me wrong; I personally am sick of the sharingan being the end-all-be-all of this manga; and all that being said, Byakugan is still the sexiest by far. Its power is limited, well-defined, and it doesn't totally break the rest of the naruto-verse.

[Murdock]

well actually that evolution from Byakugan gotta be solved somehow since Konoha was builded from Sharingan user ... so Hyuuga were part of Uchiha or what ... one big mess .. again NO OUTLINE form Kishi's part IMO :D

EDIT:
again he said that they are oldest from Konoha but Konoha was made by Uchiha and Senju so Hyuuga was with Senju then how Sharingan can be made out of Byakugan ... mess :D

[blind]

Just because Konoha was established (partially) by a Sharingan user, doesn't mean Sharingan precedes Byakyugan. Shodai was collecting clans before he collaborated with Madara, Byakyugan could have came from one of those clans.

[papfles]

He will have to leave if his bodies keep getting killed. I doubt that he can actually take on all of Konoha by himself.

Actually, if his summoning body survives, he can keep recalling his bodies, no?

That's why I would always keep the summoning body safe.

[blind]

Actually, if his summoning body survives, he can keep recalling his bodies, no?

That's why I would always keep the summoning body safe.

Does he still even have a summoning body? Or do you mean the Yahiko Pein body? If so, that would make sense, since he does have anothing body with him at the moment, assuming it's for his protection.

[DonEmu]

The summoning body is the one that looked female. And it can only summon the active 6 or else we would have more than 6 Peins. So the summoning body is only a problem if the others are un-harmed and are not present and it can call it.

I think people didn't get my point that he most likely needs to prep a body beforehand before he can use it in battle. Meaning if one body is damaged, the body that revived the original three in the first fight is actually what is most important.

[JD021]

pain is going to destroy most of the village and theyre prob going to fight him off which would take every elite ninja that the leaf has under their belt.. Cloud will make it to leaf after the attack is finished-Naruto will come back & most likely it will Be Sand-Leaf & Cloud Vs Akatsuki-rain(pain is liek a god to them)- Hidden mist ( Madara is Mizukage).. i forgot what the other hidden village is but im sure theyll get involved somehow im not makinjg any predictions on them yet...as far as that one eyed fagget from the leaf that killed that frog i hope he really doesnt try to snake the leaf village any further and i als ohope the elders get heart attacks and die it would also be more entertaining if they happend to run into pain when that happends..

i dont kno why anybody would doubt naruto considering the fact he doesnt have much experience is a true statement but the experience he has is with fightin ninjas that were all Jounin and Ranked S class thats more than enough proff that he coudl beat the life out of most the ninja he faces plus his shadow clone jutsu will be way stronger when hes in sage mode so im really thinking pain would not beat him if they fought espically if choji took out one of pains bodies and hes one of the least impressive ninjas in the whole entire manga IMHO

[AS The Leader]

mhh I don't understand how Pein could have revived bodies even after being defeated during the fight with Jiraiya. I don't remember who exactly said that, maybe the frog pa' but it seems strange.
Normally when one of his bodies is defeated, like now, it shouldn't be usable after right?
...or I could have read wrong

[JD021]

nah dude pain did revive the bodies i remember pervy sage killed a few of them and then those same dudes stabbed him and chopped his throat like test your might in mortal kombat =|

[DonEmu]

Jiraiya killed three bodies, but then the other bodies arrived, the Pein(Yahiko/God) said that right before the exchange with Jiraiya and the genjutsu and the whole stabbing the summoner summoned another/other(the number is unknown). So after Jiraiya killed the 3, one or more of the other were around the revive the body. What i am saying is, if the spare body wasn't around to revive the dead 3, wouldn't the other bodies be in that tube, so technically wouldn't Jiraiya had won?

The same principle applies here, if they can defeat the bodies without letting them get revived by whichever one did the reviving( i have a feeling the God/Yahiko body) then Pein would have to retreat.

[galdem]

can anybody tell me y is a "god" like pain working under madara

[dharq]

can anybody tell me y is a "god" like pain working under madara

I think it's more a matter of mutual use rather than subordination. Pein probably believes he can learn something from Madara, and it's always advantageous to work with those who're moving the same direction as you. Besides, every resources Madara spends is one that Pein doesn't have to.

It may also be a matter of Pein looking for a weakness in the sharingan--realizing it to be a true threat to his power. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer, as they say.

Besides, my bet is still on Zetsu as the real power behind Akatsuki. :biggrin1:

[Namikaze_Minato]

The true body of Pain which is nagato (I think) controls all of the other bodies so my theory is that right now he is not there and teh true power of Rinnegan is some sort of puppet mastery without and strings and doesn't have to be in the battlefield.

I really really think there is more to Rinnegan than controlling multiple bodies. We haven't even seen the 6th element that only Nagato can use. 6 bodies that each has different abilities. That is like fighting against 6 ninjas and ain't really that special. There has got to be more that makes this Rinnegan such a legendary ability.


I actually have a theory about this. I think that nagato is a sage-chakara user, and that the bodies are simply "puppets" which he transfers the sage-chakara to while he sits perfectly still away from the battle. That would explain the chakara receivers and the fact that kakashi had no clue what the god-pein body did, even with his sharingan.

This may seem far-fetched, but u have to remember that the oritional rinnegan user was called a sage, and kishi has a way of introducing a concept and having an enemy use it (ex: introducing elemental chakara to naruto, then having kakuzu fight using elemental chakara)

[dharq]

Nah, in order to learn to use the sage arts, Nagato would've had to travel to the mountain. And wouldn't the toads have said something about that by now?

Also, Jiraiya would've noticed the natural energy Pein was using if that was the case--since he could detect natural energy. Nothing was ever said of that.

Sorry, but unless this is another Kishi flub (which is highly likely given his history), I just don't think Nagato is a "sage" in the same sense Naruto and Jiraiya are.

[roy1993]

Nah, in order to learn to use the sage arts, Nagato would've had to travel to the mountain. And wouldn't the toads have said something about that by now?

Also, Jiraiya would've noticed the natural energy Pein was using if that was the case--since he could detect natural energy. Nothing was ever said of that.

Sorry, but unless this is another Kishi flub (which is highly likely given his history), I just don't think Nagato is a "sage" in the same sense Naruto and Jiraiya are.


I think that his ability is just a kekegenkai or soething. Remeber when Jiriaya saw the eyes and thought about an image of the "lord of the rinnegan" it had 6 arms, so mayvbe each of his arms are controling each body. Maybe like a puppet with no strings, or maybe something more spiritial like each arm has a mind of its own and is just controlluing them. Or something like that.

[blind]

I think that his abi